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GGR #6 at Marina...

Posted: Sun Aug 05, 2018 8:29 pm
by Ken Jones
On the map, the course looked too boxy and tight. But, walking showed how wide open it was in regards to line selection. The course was 40' wide all over. Obviously, you had to follow the course, but you had room to pick the line you liked. A welcome change for me. It turned it into more of a flowing stream or a dance. The higher horse power cars didn't have much opportunity for extended straight line speed (they had to play in the weeds with the rest of us), but it looked like most everyone had a good time. There were very few cone strikes which was probably a welcome change for course workers too.

I left after the AM runs to beat the crowds going north. It was already too late at 1pm. What a crush. Bumper to bumper stop and go as far as the eyes could see - until it opened up to three lanes many, many miles north. I can't imagine it would have been much worse for those staying the whole day. Was it?

Nice to get "reacquainted" with some LPR members - it's been a while since I ventured down there.

cheers,

kj

Re: GGR #6 at Marina...

Posted: Sun Aug 05, 2018 9:04 pm
by hpatelno3
it was indeed great seeing everyone at Marina today and yesterday (some of us were brave enough to participate in both weekend days for the zone event). I agree with the course being fun. It rewarded smooth driving. Most of us got faster when we backed off in turns a little bit. Clockwise route appeared better, based on everyone's response and lap times.

I left around 4:30PM. Google map warned me about the backup on 101 at that time. So, I took Hwy 1, Hwy152 and the back roads around the reservoirs to San Jose. That completed my weekend.


See you all at the next event.

Re: GGR #6 at Marina...

Posted: Sun Aug 05, 2018 9:36 pm
by Argote
Traffic was pretty bad on the way back. About two hours to Redwood City.

I enjoyed the course, though one slalom would have been nice. Seems like it was an exercise in picking good lines.

Not conducive to high HP. Lots of gear changes would have been ideal though, so a PDK could have been nice.

Re: GGR #6 at Marina...

Posted: Mon Aug 06, 2018 3:44 pm
by superhighperf
it was fun to hang out with all the porsche drivers and we had a good turn out for both of the days with drivers from all of bay area clubs. the course was way to tight for my driving style and much more suited to PacMan than cars. "https://www.facebook.com/plugins/post.p ... &width=500" i hope Dave comes up with some new ideas, if he keeps using lotus courses this could be next "https://www.facebook.com/plugins/post.p ... &width=500" trust me, no one wants that :cry: i never want to see that sombrero course again

the traffic back to the bay added 25-30 min to my commute starting at the top of the hill, 156 interchange, picking up in gilroy and another slow down getting through morgan hill. not a big deal, normal summer time traffic for the area.

i look forward to seeing you all again in Alameda if not sooner. Sacramento autox is this weekend and Red Wood the next.

Re: GGR #6 at Marina...

Posted: Mon Aug 06, 2018 10:29 pm
by ddunwood
I hope I never see that Sombrero course again! I was in 1st gear for a 1/3 of the course. Painful!

I saw the remnants of two accidents being cleaned up on 101 between 156 & Gilroy on the way home.

Re: GGR #6 at Marina...

Posted: Mon Aug 06, 2018 10:57 pm
by MagnusB
Slow but still fun!
Didn't properly think it through as far as the line goes. Just drove it and adjusted.
This run was 45.475 I think. Didn't record the best run :-)
https://1drv.ms/v/s!Ahz9r9CfVPWKg55DStRNtR8qviMVlQ

1h 30 min to get there in the morning, 2h 40 min to get home ...

Re: GGR #6 at Marina...

Posted: Tue Aug 07, 2018 6:54 am
by Ken Jones
Classis stuff... I think we're starting to hear a little bit of the - wait for it ---------- "damn, another 914 course!" :P

Re: GGR #6 at Marina...

Posted: Wed Aug 08, 2018 3:27 pm
by tframhein
I struggled mightily this weekend, Saturday more than Sunday. The course seemed to flow much better on Sunday, maybe because the kink at the end didn't end up breaking up an otherwise decently fast section.

I would be interested to see if there was something off about my approach. Toward the end of the day, I felt I was carving a good line and driving the tires to their limit...
But my Sport Cup 2's just never progressed past feeling cold and hard. My Cayman was more unstable, especially on corner entry, than I've ever felt it before. I had to be traveling almost completely straight to put any power down, which is very un-Porsche-like behavior. Maybe they've been through too many heat cycles, maybe it had to do with the fact they never really got up to temperature, and maybe all of this also related directly back to the surface conditions. I intend to test this by running the tread down at my next event (BMW CCA) and replacing them immediately after :D.

An illustration of instability (fun! but not fast...): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G_7nGQcRr2I

My best scratch time (cone after finish): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D2YceqMzELE

Re: GGR #6 at Marina...

Posted: Wed Aug 08, 2018 7:49 pm
by superhighperf
I had to be traveling almost completely straight to put any power down, which is very un-Porsche-like behavior.
i had a good think about my poor performance over the weekend and a lot of it had to do with traction and driving style. i think a driver who could steer with the throttle would have done good and i noticed that when we ran the course with Lotus. my friend James is that type of driver and he did well on the direction we ran Saturday, he got me by a second. we were more evenly matched the other direction and i ended up faster. we were both driving similarly prepared NB miatas. i am not comfortable driving a loose car fast and that is what it took to be fast on that course.

also, i think a limited slip diff just made things worse. the limited slip in my cars amplified the throttle over steer. as soon as the car got loose i would go off line and lost time correcting the car. i think i would have preferred an open diff. it would not have had the overall traction but with a single tire loose i could have held a better line and not lost time correcting the drift.

with all that said, a good driver would have made it work and i congratulate all the drivers that did well. i still need more practice 8)

Re: GGR #6 at Marina...

Posted: Wed Aug 08, 2018 8:18 pm
by tframhein
superhighperf wrote:
Wed Aug 08, 2018 7:49 pm
with all that said, a good driver would have made it work and i congratulate all the drivers that did well. i still need more practice 8)
For sure! Much to learn... There were some really impressive times out there this weekend.

Re: GGR #6 at Marina...

Posted: Wed Aug 08, 2018 10:15 pm
by ddunwood
I was certainly sliding around all weekend. I knew my tires were near end of life and I was having trouble turning in. Turns out my front tires were corded and blew one out first run Sunday afternoon. Here my videos.

Saturday - 46.983
https://youtu.be/PRmkSFKmrSc

Sunday - 44.643
https://youtu.be/0xefUT9OGvg

Re: GGR #6 at Marina...

Posted: Thu Aug 09, 2018 1:55 pm
by hpatelno3
Well, it was two days of fun at Marina. Turnout on both days was impressive. It was great seeing you all. Andrew showed us all how to drive really fast through the course. I know he has had reliability issue with his car in the past, but it was a shame to see Steve Lau on the side for a while.

Here is my in-car video for Sunday event - https://1drv.ms/v/s!AvpsCl-IH8Bth58GaU5HzeiDvHcZ3w. You can see the car getting loose at times. I am happy to buy that limited slip differential from a certain owner of a black Cayman who may not like his it :P .

Teddy, that was impressive car control through the long straightaway. I have seen most people spin out in that situation.

Thanks everyone for your patience in getting preliminary results. As you know, we have switched to a new timing system with this event, delaying posting a little bit. Ed plans to post preliminary results directly on the results page for this and future events. So please be on the lookout at that location. In the meantime, I do not want my friends to wait too long. Here is the link to our pre-preliminary results - https://1drv.ms/u/s!AvpsCl-IH8Bth6Ayeb-VcplFLQfWfQ. They are not authenticated by any means.

Re: GGR #6 at Marina...

Posted: Thu Aug 09, 2018 2:42 pm
by hpatelno3
The link to pre-preliminary results may not work in my previous post. Please try this one - https://1drv.ms/b/s!AvpsCl-IH8Bth6A5mwSbk6b1Rxmrjg. It now points to a PDF file.

Re: GGR #6 at Marina...

Posted: Thu Aug 09, 2018 3:15 pm
by ddunwood
LPR updated results have been posted to their Facebook page, and the LPR Website.

Re: GGR #6 at Marina...

Posted: Thu Aug 09, 2018 3:17 pm
by tframhein
Excellent car control yourself, Himanshu! Maybe I need to use first gear more...
Thanks also for the early look at timing. That you guys take time out of the week to do this does not go unnoticed :).

Re: GGR #6 at Marina...

Posted: Thu Aug 09, 2018 3:33 pm
by Argote
Thanks for the preliminary results. Careful throttle feathering was key in this track, even in my relatively tame 987 Boxster. Took me a while to get a run where everything came together.

I'm very haply to have variety in layouts throughout the season and really enjoyed the nuances of the design.

Re: GGR #6 at Marina...

Posted: Thu Aug 09, 2018 4:54 pm
by BrantyB
Thanks for posting pre-pre results. The course was fun but far more technical than those at Alameda. Thanks to all that made it happen.

Re: GGR #6 at Marina...

Posted: Fri Aug 10, 2018 7:16 pm
by Spyder_740
I could only attend Saturday, but had a really good time. I’m a Redwood regular, so i’m used to tighter technical layouts. However, I found that the Marina concrete pad had less initial turn-in grip than the RR asphalt, or Alameda. Add in the cool air temps, and my tires were cool to the touch even after my last run, which was a first for me.

I found that I had to adjust from my usual more aggressive attacking the corner style, to one of earlier, smoother braking and quickly rolling on the throttle coming out of turns. At RR or Alameda, I can usually slam the throttle shut 3/4 into a turn and steer my way out with my Spyder’s neutral balance. This was a lesson in patience that ultimately allowed me to crack the 47s by slowing down my corner entry and working on smooth, no drama exits. It wasn’t as exhilarating, but a good lesson for me in adapting to varied conditions.

My favorite part (as always) is benchmarking against the fast watercooled mid-engined guys (Himanshu, Derek, Teddy and Grady) who keep me pushing hard and improving.

Teddy - you may not have had your usual grip, but man was your first lap cool when you linked up at least three corners in Formula D perfection! I forgot to tell you that. You have that Cayman’s limits down!

-Doug

Re: GGR #6 at Marina...

Posted: Fri Aug 10, 2018 11:21 pm
by ovidiu
I struggled too on Saturday, especially in the afternoon when I could not match my best run from the morning. The course on Sunday felt much better however and I managed to put down a lot of good times in the afternoon.

Here's my best run on Sunday:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8LGIrVHp-uE

And here's my best run on Saturday:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XaWkFk8QflM

Overall a good weekend of autocross. I'll see you guys at Alameda in September!

Re: GGR #6 at Marina...

Posted: Sat Aug 11, 2018 3:57 pm
by tframhein
Spyder_740 wrote:
Fri Aug 10, 2018 7:16 pm
Teddy - you may not have had your usual grip, but man was your first lap cool when you linked up at least three corners in Formula D perfection! I forgot to tell you that. You have that Cayman’s limits down!

-Doug
Thanks! I was secretly hoping somebody saw that, as I don’t have video. The rear snapped on entry earlier than I expected, and by the time I had the first slide accounted for it was time to turn in for the following right hander, and... :D
The way the Cayman’s front end continues to respond to small steering inputs even when sliding is just awesome.